raw-transcript-eman.md

An introduction. Just say a little about who you are. Yes, my name is Eman and I am from originally from Pakistan. I grew up there. And when I was 18, I moved here with my family, my whole family.

And yeah, I've been living in Manchester since then I started going to Uni in 2019. I did a foundation year. Then I also did a place in the air, so I have been here a total of five years. It was a very long time. It seems like and a lot's happened in the last five years.

Honestly, I I just I cannot even tell you how different I am to that girl, during 19. So, um, Uh, what was it that made you think about studying computer science? Not not why Manchester but why, you know why Computing? Where can you, can you remember a time when yes I could literally exactly remember the time.

So the first time I actually got a PC, it was, um, my uncle, he gave me it for my birthday. And on that there were like a few games, it was like GTA V City and you. Disranded. Yes. And I was just complete. That what? Ages hours and hours and you know how I just think?

Wow, that's a really cool game. What if I can make one? I was literally a child at that time. No idea how to do anything before, like, this Primary school or secondary school. This is Primary school. Yeah, so it's like probably it was a bit young to be playing Western you, to be honest.

But, um, then in school, there was so the way my I went to a racist strict school, it was an all girls school and, um, Had to get a certain Mark, to be able to do medicine and If you go below that you went into computer science and if you go below that you went into like Commerce or something, right?

Which is last time you talk about how not nice that is but um, Parents always wanted me to do medicine, like, when I was young and I was like, okay, fine, I'll try my best to do medicine. Not really wanting to do medicine. Going to like um, I didn't get the grade for medicine going to computer science.

Now I never actually imagined doing computer science like I I played the games and I just forgot about it was like okay maybe I gained medicine if I don't I'll probably go into like business or something and then purely by chance. I going to computer science and in that like um First thing I've recorded in was Visual Basic, right?

Like and it was so interesting. Like it was like, You know, you could do something and it shows like it's just text on the screen and it shows up to be like something cool on another screen and it's just, you know, it really this isn't back in in high school.

Now, I guess, is that? Yes, I was in high school. I was what about 14? 15 around that time? I thought this is interesting. Okay, that's interesting. So the kind of medicines at the top. Yeah. I personally think of yourself, it's harder than medicine, but you that might be a controversial opinion.

Okay good. So you're right here in 2019. You did a foundation. Um and I guess by that point you decided you wanted to study computer science as a degree. Yes. So can you talk us through the first few years? Yeah. Basically like was when I did computer science. I was this is like year eight when I started doing computer, science was your basic.

So year, nine year ten, I'm children, computer science. I've done um C in year 1910. 11 year 12. I was also still doing C I think in college and then I was really good at it. Like, I was just good at, um, Just quoting I guess, you know, it's making logic like Making sense like I could.

Yes. Yeah. And I was just, you know, good at it and I I really liked it, like, it was a module. I I really enjoyed English as well. That was like, my first, you know, I was like, I love English, but I told my parents like what if I want to become a gentlemanist?

They were like, okay? What if you do like a science degree first and then you can also become a journalist on the side. I was like, I don't know how that works, by sure. So I, you know, I did all that I was really good. I did really well in my exams as well.

And I was like, you know what, I think like I could definitely make a future out of this. It wasn't actually, I'll be very honest. It wasn't like for my passion of computer science as much. Like how much you get paid in computer science? On engineering, I think in Pakistan engineering has a possibly a higher ranking than it does here, everyone wants to be.

If I can't be a medic, I'll be an engineer. Definitely, I think like there's mostly Engineers over there even more than medicine and so it's quite a bit comfortable difference between here in the UK. I mean we do people do study engineering here not perhaps not in the in the same it doesn't have the same prestige but yeah.

Well, like I just you know, I did definitely love computer science and I was really good at it but um It was more like, oh my God, I can get, you know, paid a lot. And that's like such a, I don't know what I was thinking to. Um, I've been reasonable, not an unreasonable motivation.

Trying to be rich So good, so you got through Um, the foundation year. First year, I think you mentioned, were you, were you a student ambassador at what point did being a student applied to be a student ambassador in first year, so. Okay, so basically my Foundation, there started, I did.

The first semester came to UNI, I wasn't not campus, that's where it was before and then covet happened. Second semester, right? So everything seconds master of conditions, yeah. Oh, uh, all right. Okay, yeah. Of course, 2019. Yeah. So that's when it started. And it was actually crazy at that time to be in uni and, um, this it the way it happened was like, one day.

We were just coming to UNI and then the next day was like, getting a like, an email from newly like, oh my God. Don't come from tomorrow. Okay. That's like so it was it was really crazy going from that to that. Um, but uh,

Call with, that's when. Um, you know, especially as some advantage over your peers in that, you had actually an introduction to university life. Yeah. Fellow first year, students, were coming to it. Definitely the beginning. I literally, um, I was in the I was a student ambassador for the foundation there.

Um, like, you know, when When people are considering doing productioneer and this is like my biggest point but which I would make, I would tell them, you know, you get a headshot to UNI before you even start uni. So like you, you know, so many people, you know, everything about the university already and like I really enjoyed it even though when I first tried it, I was really upset about it because I did really really well in Pakistan.

And other units, they offered me like a straight first year, right Manchester didn't, right because I hadn't done a levels, right? And uh, like at that time, I was so upset about, I was like, because why does that matter like it's Pakistan's board you know, like I I fully did what anyone who did a levels would do, but they made me do it and I was like, okay fine just to get into Manchester because my parents really wanted me to go ahead and I was like yeah.

And also that the other thing was the money. It was a lot. It was about 18K for Foundation there and um, as an international student and I just didn't want to pay that much more. Yeah, yeah. She really make your degree longer basically. Yeah, exactly. And also, like, what things I've already knew as well.

So it was just, you know, I was like, why do I have to do this? Well, I guess. I mean, there's a whole calculation there about like equivalency of different exams and different countries. Exactly how people do that. I know I understand why but I also you know on the other hand just like oh my God.

Your first year or first, first year, after Foundation year, you were in, you're in covid. But then in second year, I guess things were starting to open up a little bit. And was it at that point you decided to think about doing the placement or is it something you decided before I think in first year when um, I it was when you give the placement talk a second there.

Yeah. Is that what it was? The one at the beginning? Yes. Yes. I I like I'm gonna tell you right now. Those are so helpful because I came to that and like I was I I definitely wanted to do it I but they know I wasn't sure about it and then I left that talk thinking yeah.

I definitely want to do a placement. Yeah because um as as you know, like there's so many benefits of it and I will always say that you should do it. Thing on your CV like a good company, a Years of experience before you even finish uni. I think that's just That's really good personally.

Um, yeah, yeah. Okay, good. So I mean the second year is quite a demanding year as well, isn't it? Because suddenly the workload goes Up. I, I have like a traumatic experience a second there. Like, when I think about it, it's all. Oh my God. The the placement applications and then, the coursework, it was crazy.

How did you manage that? Max. That's a tricky. I will tell you, I don't think I did. Personally, I don't think I did very manager, very well. I, um, I, I got like an 80 something in first year and then I, by the time I finished second there, I was like at a 65 and, um, That was actually very crazy for me because at least like I was expecting her first.

So I didn't really manage it that well, and it was like, I it was one of the other like I could either have a life while at Uni and also do the rest of it. Like do you need and also have friends a good circle to like keep my mental health, you know?

A plan and then there was a just put myself in my room just cold and then apply for jobs and just not go out and I just chose the latter because you know in like five years when I look at Uni I don't want to remember myself just in my room just coding I want to remember myself like, you know, being a society is doing new things.

Yeah. Yeah. So yeah. I mean, I guess. Did you have many rejections along the way? Did you have to apply to lots of places? I'm pretty sure I told you this before, but I think I applied to what 70 to 90 companies. And I got interviews from two, three and Bentley was someone who accepted me.

I think I got one more company. They accepted, but it wasn't like, obviously Bentley because it's a big name. I, I definitely went with them, but it was always like a very exhausting experience. It just gets to you, you know, demoralising, right? You're getting all these, you're spending all this time, doing these applications, and all you get back is, uh, exactly.

Like it's just not even about the rejection letters. It's about. The, the process of actually applying like I, I can't tell you how exhausted I was after second year that entire day, I couldn't even bring myself to apply, and I didn't like, I'll talk about this a bit more later.

But at all of second day, I was just applying, like, applying applying applying app.

Getting nothing out of this. I'm spending hours on these applications getting nothing. Not even sometimes an email to say sorry. Just ghost you. Yeah. So I mean, that's pretty normal I think. But it's, uh, it's, it's tough. So, what point in the year did you get the the offer from Bentley?

I think it was in January. Right. So like normal. Yeah, yeah, I I actually applied in December for Bentley and it was quite fast the interview process. Um there was only one interview so they um Email the and they were like, can you attend this? And actually, I re I actually wasn't gonna go to the interview, which is very crazy because I had a lot of coursework going on, right?

Yeah, I was like, oh my God, I'm not gonna get it. Anyway this, this was my first real interview and I'm not gonna get it anyway, I'm just gonna not go. I'm gonna cancel and I did cancel the first one and then I asked them to reschedule and I was like, no, I have to do this.

I have to and I went and look, I got the placement. That was pretty good. I mean some of them are really tough and I'll say like that if their exams, there's an exam period in January. Your interview happens to fall on an exam day. They'll say well. Sorry next.

Exactly, exactly. Because it's not like they've got. They're gonna wait for you. They've got a whole list of people already. I'm not tough. Yeah. So, um, I guess that's nice in January then because you've got something and you finally got something to show for all that hard work you've done at the beginning of the second year.

So can you well? So firstly for people who don't know what can you say, what what Bentley is and then what your role was over the time that you were there? Um, I will say a little bit about my interview first. Oh yeah, because we were talking about that earlier, say about that.

Um, so it was like a, they just told me to prepare a presentation on like a piece of coursework I had done before and I showed them software engineering. Sorry, and I showed them Centre and they were pretty like, oh wow, you can do this. And I just went took them to how I, you know the what was the task do.

So you're fixing bugs and I took them through that and they were quite impressed with that. And then um there were a series of eight questions and it was just Real behavioural. Yes, that's the word. I want to know what you'll like, as a person rather than just what, you know, what skills you have.

And they do not like send me anything to prepare for that they told me to do the start with it. Is that what it is? What star emitted. Oh star like situation tasks. Yes, action results. I think so. I think that's it. That's they just said you need to know this method when you're answering your questions then they asked me eight questions and it was like what um Like I'll give an example one but when what's the situation you were in where like you encountered a problem and how did you?

Um, Like, you know, deal with it. And I fully just I worked at m s since foundation year, and I cannot tell you, I did not say a single apart from that, um, schedule code, I did not talk about computer science, even once I was just talking about my experience, I'm m, s how like a customer did this and I did that and, you know, like it was just eight questions of me, just answering through my experience of mns.

And I'm pretty sure I have friends who have had these questions before and they just like sat there because they don't know how to answer these if you haven't really thought about it. If you thought about a little bit before, yeah, can usually come up and you can even come up with one, you know, you can make one up but at that time like right there in front of them, no like preparation.

I was just like, oh my God, this m s this. So yeah, it was, it was basketball and, you know, important skills. Like I guess you were probably dealing with difficult customers. Yeah. Demanding workload.

I always say even at like a retail store if you come here you should definitely look for a job. Just like even if it's you're working just the weekends a few hours on the weekend. It's so good to like just build your people skills, how you talk to people because I I feel like pressing die is such a big thing to know how to talk to people because you could be really good at something and you could just completely mess up your interview because you don't know how to yeah you talk to your interviewer so it's definitely okay.

So um, Them. Well, you've got the offer. Yeah. Um you started in I guess would it have been the summer of I did August? End of August. Yeah. So can you tell us a little? Well, tell us a little about what Ben who Bentley are for people who don't know and what you what your role.

So Bentley is a car company. Basically they make luxury cars. So not like normal ones, not something I would, I could afford right now, maybe one day, maybe one day. Hopefully, Um, yeah, like it's a car manufacturer. They, they had a factory and crew, so that's an hour away from Manchester and, um, here's how are you based you're based?

Yes, I was in crew, but I was living in Manchester. Well, because crews there was a remote working or it was hybrid. So I had to go in maybe two days uh, in sometimes and three days I would work from home and um I would drive from Manchester to crew because crew is giving you a company Bentley to drive.

No, Everyone asked me that and I knew you would ask me that. It's literally like every anyone I've ever told I worked at Bentley. I was asking did they give you a medley please? It besides giving their employees Bentleys. I'm not sure. Um so you you were something that.

Yeah so what was what was your role? I mean I guess you probably have several roles at Bentley but what was your what were the sort of things? So The team I was in the main thing was they? They were making actually, it's been so long. Let me just remember why I was Sorry, they, uh, they they would work on projects like um, around the factory and they would make sure to I don't asleep, like, try and make sense of this.

So let me give you an example. Um, so someone proposed a project, which was, uh, tracking cars in around the factory because they would get lost some, our worker would just leave them somewhere. So, my team had to go and find a solution to this tracking car problem deliver, the solution find the funding for it.

Like, make up the solution, how are we doing this? So, beautiful tracking devices on the cars and then deliver it. And like I worked on about four projects during this time and how to. So like it was basically coming taking a problem, coming up with the solution and then delivering the solution.

That's what my team was sure, right. Yeah, I guess technology was a big part of that, you kind of had lots of different Technologies. I did, I wasn't hard coding. So like, um, Bentley doesn't employ software engineers

So, it was more the requirements Gathering part and I'm talking to customers what they want and then giving it to the software engineer to code. So, you were doing all the work right before you start coding something. So, you would make wireframes and you would, you know, all that, that's what we were doing.

Um you have to understand, right? So I think there's quite an interesting roles here is that you have to understand the code from the point of view of explaining it to a software engineer. What's required? Exactly. Yeah. But also then also be able to speak to the customer. Yeah, exactly.

The stakeholder or whatever the business as to what's needed, because you're the middleman, right? So like you're talking to the people who want it and the software Engineers as well. So you have to know how to actually convert what someone wants into a piece of logical, you know, code and expand to the.

Yeah, right. Okay, good. So we're doing, I mean lots of little projects like that I guess over the big projects I suppose over the course, there were a lot of like my finding their project was the project I was working on before I left Bentley. So like there was a big project about like um the car tracking thing I mentioned and um There at Bentley because the requirement Gathering part wasn't.

Um, good. So that the way they record the, my team before they, I wasn't there, when this happened, the requirement Gathering, but the way they did that, it wasn't um, translating the waterfall method where the kind of all the requirements are done at the beginning or using more agile approach.

Um, it was a, I think it was agile in a way because I didn't really when they were doing it, I didn't really know what was happening because I wasn't there. So when I I joined, they were in the process of delivering it. So I was just stuck in the, you know, delivering it to like the workshop, the trim shop and everyone hated it.

So I was just like, you know, we were just getting a uh oh my God we need a better thing because we need this project right now and you're just not you know? Like this is not good. All the workers were not happy with us.

When we gathered the requirements, it was more of an agile approach. Yeah. Good. All right. So you spent 12 months So this is and then you come back for two, did you often you've mentioned, you've done your third year project before you went to Bentley. No. So you come back and do that.

Yeah, so let's talk about um what happened when you came back so you've done your your three years. Yeah you've done your your industry and we're now we must be now at 2023 last year, we are you come back for your final year project I guess it's kind of nice coming back to University.

Appreciate what's good about University? Can you tell us a little bit about weed if you'll find your project? So, coming back was a bit. It was very because I'd going used to no studying as much and like just doing my job going home to like you know, I'm chilling.

And then coming back, I was like, oh my God. Like this is a constant again, no trauma. Um but for my third project, I was actually making, you know, when I left Bentley, I had just finished the requirement Gathering part so I never got to. We were speaking to AWS but like they were the quotas, you know?

So we had to give them the solutions but I never got to actually like we were in the beginning of the process when I when I left and um Project was basically to create to code, be it AWS in the sense and create the card, tracking software that I was speaking about.

But, um, this I, when I did this, I spoke to Bentley and they told me You know we're gonna you have you can have a full support, like whatever you need and then they kind of like just didn't stop replying to my emails and before I left like I got so much reassurance from them, I was like oh my God like I don't think I will be able to like this was my biggest problem.

I was like what if you guys don't like, just don't give me the things I need and they know exactly that. So I thought I could do so much with the project and then I come here and I Terry was my supervisor Darren Smalley. Yeah. I like the way I started off with telling him.

Oh, I'm so good. Like, you know, we can do this this and like halfway through the year, I go to him and I'm like, Terry, I have nothing. I don't know how to do this. I have no data. I cannot show you. Um, I cannot take anything from them because it's uh, so private.

Yeah. Private and you can't even read my report if I put anything Bentley in there like I just can't I don't know what to do. Like this is halfway through third year like I have actually like done nothing for the I can do this, this nothing and Terry just sits behind.

He's like do what you can like just make a car tracking software. It doesn't have to be for Bentley, just make a software like okay. Yeah, exactly. And like, you're just take the problem that you had. For making that software for your inspiration, make the software. It just doesn't have to be abundantly anymore but that's why I did right.

Yeah, so so using some it's like RFID or yes, that was a from the beginning. It was I went to use RFID, but that is a big scale project and expensive like rfids are not achieved. So, I used a barcode scanner and I made my project in a way where this is like a prototype for webbed League can use for their system, okay.

On the production line, they do use and everything. I guess that was one of the things with Bentley and why I thought like I liked working, there is because they had a lot of innovation, like they could. There was a lot of work to be done with their production system, right?

Because they're the way their methods were. There were, so, very old school. So, you know, RFID is such a great thing and they just haven't Incorporated that into their things. So that's why like, this was our project to like, actually incorporate RFID because right now, what they were doing were like scanning several scanners right to like scan barcodes on, um, like a piece of paper.

So it was all paper based their tracking, okay. Which is my what my project was to like, remove the paper-based aspect of it up completely, right? Yeah. And I said, I suppose a luxury car manufacturers, it part of it is output, right? If you're if you're a Ford or a General Motors or somebody your your production lines are probably operating at higher throughput.

Yeah. Whereas at Bentley I'd imagine it's more of

But it's much, much lower because these are luxury cars. You have to pay a lot for them and obviously there are a lot of rich people in the world, but not as much as let's say. Audi, you know. Yeah, or something else. Yeah, right, okay, so you've got you delivered a project in the end that had a sort of prototype of this car tracking system using barcodes and stuff.

Yes, I, you know, like at the, uh, maybe two days before my project, I sent Terry my report that I had written and, um, he sends me an email back and he says, Iman like the last chapter of your report is like you can get. Um what what's the word for academic?

Prize distinction. No, no, no, no no. Oh right. Okay, uh, no, no. Oh malpractice. Yeah, all right. You replied to me and he was like this could be our academic math practise because in the report I have written it like Bentley has employed my system right deployed my system and he's like you're just making this up it's not possible for you to do it and I was like, but I sent my team like a survey to like use my system and do it and he was like, no.

This and it says, two days before the submission deadline and already taken an extension. So this is like I have to submit it so that actually was about traumatizing again. So, I have one day to like, rewrite my chapter, and he's like, everything makes sense. It's just where you're talking about Bentley actually deploying the system.

You have to say that you deployed it at the University, like you made people use your system and and that's what I had done. I just said it, I done it with Bentley and obviously that was a big mistake from my part but um I go on 80 on my project.

Thank you so much. I know. Because when I actually submitted the project, I was like 50 academic after getting accused of academic malpractice, I'm not even getting anywhere close to 60, so it's nice. I mean because you you, that was effectively your own project, right? So you proposed it and I think it's often more enjoyable when you do a project.

That's you're right. I know, I know definitely somebody else. I, you know, they were good bad good parts about and then there were bad parts about it. The the good part was that? Oh my God, like I have my own idea, I can, um, deliver it however, I like, you know, I can make up my own requirements and deliver them.

And then there was the other part where it was like, I don't know what to do, I don't know what trajectory to go off of, you know, like I I could do this this with it but like I don't it just doesn't make sense in my head. How do I do this?

Yeah that's tough but worth it. I think you know in the long term is working

Definitely like I think that was what was like a very big lesson for me to like look at how Bentley just you know, didn't really reply to my emails at one point. And I was just left alone in a way and to like actually overcome that. I suppose it's difficult because you're not at this point, you're no longer an employee, right?

Yeah, exactly. You probably don't, you don't have a Bentley email address anymore. Exactly, exactly. Emailing from my private email like, please someone That's the end of your and you spent your final year. You've now finished. You did the exams, you've got your result now your graduating next week. So, uh, can you say a little bit about what you're planning to do next or that you can talk about?

I mean, you might not want it. Yeah, I definitely. Um, I'm currently doing a placement, uh, with. Uh, basically. I did a podcast like, I worked as a student ambassador, right? Yes. And, um, this is the sisters and my sisters. Yes. And um, Jasmine Jasmine and Charlene, right? Okay.

Yes. And make sure we name Chequers. Yes. And um, but basically I would definitely recommend going like trying to apply question Ambassador because I think my time at University. I I'm also like I don't want to sound like but I'm I also got an email a few days ago.

I'm getting an award right for um Called head of the department? Yeah, yeah, I don't know who I recommended me for it, but thank you. Whoever is this thing. If you're a lecturer, thank you so much. But um, I got that email and I was just sat there looking at it because I was like, there's no way there's I, I cannot believe it, like, it can't be me.

And um, I think like as a student ambassador, I just got like, I was interacting with like, you know, people so much. Like I think you probably saw me as a student ambassador. The first time you saw me like the same with Terry, the same with Markel and I just think, like, it's such a good way to, um, actually interact with your department, get to know people.

And that's how Charlene. Sorry, Jasmine knew me and she emailed me. And she said, do you want to do a podcast and through that? I met Charlene, who has now? Given me a job, right? Okay. Right. You see the power of connections like it's crazy. It's a AI, I'm working as an AI researcher in fashion.

So how can we incorporate? Yeah, I know. It's so cool. And so, so how can you incorporate AI into, um, the fashion industry? And how can you, you know, there's so much waste, um, environmental waste and like fashion industry. So how can you use AI to? Like, you know, make your processes more like

Oh great. Okay, so that started now or have you started? I have tried this one day. Okay, yeah, sorry. Um, they just this week? Yeah, this week, yeah. Okay, great. So So we look forward to seeing your graduation and your family next week, hopefully, uh, and everyone else. Um, So the other the other standard questions I ask are one.

This one is a minority report. So Yo, as a as a woman in technology and computer science, I'd be interested to hear about your experience of that. And then the other minority groups that you've been a part of that you you'd like to happy to discuss. Um, I think like personally in computer science, the department, it's like, It's not like blatant sexism in any way know where they're like, oh my God, you're a woman.

You can't do this or but it's like but you're in a minority, right? Yes, I don't know what this is about 20 15. Yeah, I'm I, I think like, it's getting better at the Year's progress, but definitely, we are like, if there's a, you know, in all the teams, there's always like five guys.

And then there's gonna be a one girl or two girls in there because they have to That's pretty. I've always found that funny because even in Foundation, they would Group you in like all the the modu, sorry the courses, you want to progress in Foundation University. We're trying to make it so that there's no group with one woman in it.

So there's at least two two women. That's why. Yeah, so that's why I was I had one girl with me in foundation here. And now, I'm still such good friends with her. Because the first year I met her, I went to her and I was like we are the only women here.

Let's be friends. That's how I said, hi to her. So, you know, So, I mean, generally positive experience of being A woman in Computing in the department that's been, okay. I mean I guess you've had some battles there but yeah it's like I I would say it's it's like it has been a positive experience.

I'm going to do so much um with like for with who I am. And that was one of my reasons for wanting to go and study abroad because I don't think in Pakistan. I as a woman I could have got into where I am. Uh, So, um, definitely, but there's like little slight things.

It's like, How do I, how do I say it? It's like, you know, when you're studying a module and you're trying to understand what's happening And it's like you there's no like less. Like you know I'm gonna say give an example of Zara again because I actually like love her as a person and like what she's doing because she is um Like she's so cool.

The first like I took graphics and um she she was sorry Zara. Yeah, yeah. Um, and she she was there like the first year at the lecture and she was like, oh I worked at Disney and I was just okay. I was like, whoa. God, you know, like, um, and Zara is a, as a Muslim, you know, she wears a hijab and I, I just like, I see myself, you know, but it's just like the person that's from a similar background as you and I see myself and her like, because she can do it.

I could possibly go and work at Disney one day, and this was like at the beginning where I couldn't even imagine, like, going to Disney and like getting mentioned in the credits. Or something, you know, like and she did and it's just like representation. I think it matters a lot and we don't see that much of it at all basically.

Like um, I think I've seen About what, two three professors of colour and the like in the whole department well who have like taught me and I think like that's one thing that um I I don't like, think it's good, because we definitely need representation in the department because we get so many people from so many, like India, let's say, Pakistan.

Um, there's a lot of kids like who would love to see people who look like them, maybe teach them just so they can relate and, you know, so yeah. That's my yeah. Saying is sometimes called seeing us seeing yourself in the curriculum, yeah. Yourself in the curriculum and you feel like this curriculum, you feel like something for you and you belong there.

Um, what about the workplace are any any, what was your experience of being a woman in the workplace? Is there any any things that could be improved there or this is where, like I'm like. Um, so I worked at Bentley and I was in the manufacturing department. Now, the manufacturing Department of any car company is a very male dominated, uh, Department.

It's like, you know, you're working on like creating the cards designing the cars. It's just men and it was the same with my team. It was all like there was eight people in the team. I was the only woman, right? And when I was leaving, I think another woman joined the team like a week before I left, and but I was the only girl and um, I loved working at Bentley first, like to say, like I got so much experience.

I got to drive a Bentley, I got to drive it. I went to Silverstone. I went, I drove it on the race track, you know, it was really cool as a but, um, there was one thing, like I'll, I'll explain it. So, I would work on projects and I sometimes, like, obviously, um, there was an apprentice with me, but he was in Australia, so he had been at the company.

Videos in the team, you know and the rest were just seniors and we would work a lot together on projects. So um while we were both working On some projects I sometimes I would do much more work than him on a certain project and sometimes he would do work on another one.

But anytime we would be in a meeting, They would address him. And like to ask questions and they would never ask me, right? Yeah. And that was so like shocking to me because you know, I have done so much for this project, you know, and I would like to speak about it because he couldn't answer the questions that, you know, I because I have done the work and it was very shocking for me because it wasn't like, oh my God.

It was so obvious because they wouldn't even speak to me. Like, I would just be sad in the meeting silent. I was also the only person of colour in the at the only woman, the only personal colour and you know, like it was It was just men talking about football, like, even in my team, you know?

Oh, bro, like my wife this this and it was, you know, I just couldn't relate to the team and then I would see my friends who were like in other departments and they were like, oh my God, we like, we talk about this, this, with my manager who the woman and I just be like, oh, I cannot relate in the slightest myth because I literally get ignored in the meetings or like, even when I do work, no one even asked me.

So I like this one time I was so upset. What do you do? I mean, do you Came with a way of managing this or what I would love to say I did but I actually didn't. So this one time it was so bad that I called my manager and it's so embarrassing to this day, but he, I just called him.

And I was like, really upset, you know, and I started crying in front of him. And I was to this day. So impressive, because I was just like crying. I was like, actually so big because I was just like, I've had enough of this, I don't know why this is happening and he told me that he was a really good manager.

First of all, I don't think I would have like Actually finish the placement. If it wasn't for him, he was very like, you know, I did one. What's it called? Daily stand up. Yeah. They asked me what problems I was having. So it was a very good manager but, um, he literally told me he was, like, do you want me to racist?

Like do you want like go and like talk to people about this? But I was like, I don't want to make waves in the in the company. Like, I'm literally here for a year. I want to be remembered and like you know I don't want because, you know, the culture of like how this works is like, oh, I'm a woman and then obviously, I could be categorous just like They could talk about me behind my back.

Oh, she complained about us and I just don't want that. So I just wanted. No please. Like I actually begged him. He was so upset. He was like, no, I'm gonna go and I was like, no, please don't please don't. Because it's like I just have a few minutes left and like that's one thing I think like, that wasn't very good because and I think this is to be expected to be fair.

Like I even though I started because as a manufacturing department, and it's so male dominated, but that was my only thing that I was like, I, you know, I wouldn't want to especially really the only shouldn't have to be on you, to raise it. Exactly. The people in the room, firstly.

Recognise, that it's happening because they might not even recognise that it's happening, and then secondly, that, okay, make sure that we hear from everybody kind of thing because that's easy. I've done it myself. You know, you Overlook people without realising that you're overlooking them. So yeah, it's it's I don't know.

I don't think this is a problem unique to Bentley by any means. Yeah, yeah, no definitely. And I just want to say like I'm a very talkative person. Like, I'm confident and I could see that just

Self. Yeah, and that's so crazy for me because I love to talk. I love to like, you know, just just yep. And it was like, very, very crazy to just like see that part of me and step away. Yeah, yeah. Good. Okay, good. And is there anything else on uh oh.

So the other thing I'm saying because you you served on we had this institute teaching and learning conference To go and you served on a panel, you're a member of a panel. Yeah. And something you were talking about in that diversity panel. That was interesting. Yeah. Um, so it was, as I said it's about representation and the biggest thing, I like it's actually a very big problem.

And I, I didn't like, I couldn't believe it when I, when it started happening. So, you know how we celebrated, and, um, it's like it's definitely not during the days of Christmas. It's, that's the time of year, is it? It's, it's not like a certain time, so they follow a Muslim calendar, which is a different calendar to the one we follow.

So I could just, you know, Know it from like, oh a month before that? Yeah, it's gonna come if you like know the Muslim Canada, but, um, So, like, it could be You know, like it happens twice a year and like everyone knows when like it's about to happen and um It was like, With the deadlines like um or even just like University and lectures.

It was never like recognised so it was Eid and you were expected to like deliver. Even though like you're actually like, you know, this is our version of Christmas and um I would actually like to talk like about how I was supposed to do like an interview, like no interview like a little student ambassador job.

And uh, if they were meant to, uh, film on the day of eight, I told them always eat, you know, can we reschedule? And they said, oh, it's fine. Like we'll find someone else because You you know like the camera crew is coming that day. Yeah. And it just made me really upset because I really wanted to do it and you know, like I think these things are overlooked that, um, because for Christmas, you get a whole month off, you know, and it's such a big thing.

The University has the Christmas tree and I never really see that kind of like representation for like any of us for it? Not even like uh oh of course there will be like actually that's just side happening recently. Or two before that there was no post for like Eid.

But they recently tried doing that like opposed to seven. Yeah, social media. Yeah, yeah. Before that there wasn't even that. Well, that's the stocks. I mean, there'll be people who didn't even realise that it's actually happening. Yeah, exactly. That's what Exactly. Like I understand why most people wouldn't really bother to like, know about this, but just fair enough, but then as the university as someone who has so many kids who celebrate Eid, this is your job to know about 20 years and like trying to, you know, if it's not, you know, there's a lot of things that can be done.

I I, you know, if like the head of the department knows about this and he says, like, oh, like he's gonna come up because the dates of Eid like you can know them a year before even so like, let's just not do it on that. Like don't put a deadline on that day or something that would be great.

But and that'd be I think it'd be relatively. Well, yeah, I mean there would be problems if it's a movable thing, but if you say, you know, it a year in advance. Yeah. Yeah. You can literally, you definitely can. So, actually, that leads on nicely to our next point.

So, uh, the University Manchester is, uh, has a new vice Chancellor, starting next month. You are the new vice chancellor responsibility. And, I'd like to know what you would do. I mean, besides perhaps I think we've already talked about Eid What would you do to improve the quality of the teaching and learning that goes on in the University not just in computer science, but across the whole university because I guess, you know, other students who've studied other subjects.

Uh, but the teaching and learning, I there have been modules that I'll firstly, talk about computer science more because that's what I've seen. But, um, there have been, obviously there's really good modules, and then there's bad modules. And what I've seen is, especially in the first year I, um, I really struggled um, because I only don't see at that time.

And first year as Python and Java, and they're both very different to see in a way. And, um, when I Like coding and stuff. I believe like what we're taught. Uh, in first year, it does not translate to like the standard of coursework, they like, ask us to give them.

I, how do I explain this. So like you'll you'll get to like a very basic things, um, in the module. And then the courser will be, oh, quite a whole game. And I really struggled with that, and I think this this has happened with a lot of modules where you're getting taught, the most basic things, and then you're asked to do a very complicated.

Yeah, exactly. Because of coursework is so complicated and you're like, looking through your lecture, know what you're saying. Oh, where is this mention? You know, where, where have they taught me this, like, how to do this? And, um, I believe like if you're learning something, you shouldn't have to go and like, go on YouTube and watch a video.

If you're actually paying this much to the USG to learn something, and I have had to do that a lot. And I know like everyone I know has had to do that a lot where like even the content you're supposed to know, it's it's just not like it's not being taught in the way.

And I, you know, being guilty of this myself sometimes is you have to pay close attention to the learning objectives and make sure that the things that you're assessing align. Yeah, exactly. As closely as you can to what Trying to assess or trying to teach. And that doesn't always happen and So I I mean, I guess that's, yeah, that would be, that would be I definitely, I think, you know, sometimes it's just like, you know, being taught the things you are expected to know and then how are you?

How do you know them, actually? I think it's difficult, you want a little bit of discomfort in your learning and that if it's just in your comfort zone and you're just doing things, you already know, need to know to do. Then you're not pushing yourself, but in your case, it sounds like there are cases when you're being pushed too much, right?

Yeah, I get a little bit but like, how can you show me how to like code? Say hello world and then you asked me to, you know, like edit. And I mean, this is like a obviously, it's like a bigger example. Yeah, you're there. But this is like a very small one.

I can't like go and create a big piece of code. If like, I don't know how to make like little chunks of at least, how to do the big one, you know. Yeah, yeah. Okay. Anything else you do with eyes? I'm like that. That's, that's quite a big one.

Actually there. That would take a long time. I, I definitely think think

Headache towards like the people who are struggling with it. It's, it's so important because I, I understand not being political and taking like You know, different chances but um I just feel like You know, there's like a, you know, there's a saying like being silent and taking the side of your, uh, And I just think personally, like, Sometimes a little bit of sympathy just to go to towards your student just just to tell them you know, like we are here with you like if you're going through this like we completely understand, you know, it's just, it's just you don't really get that these days and it's just

I that also makes you feel like you don't really belong in this University and that the the higher-ups like they don't really care about you.

And I think that's a really big problem here. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. I mean, there are there are there are The services for helping mental health. But I think it is difficult because sometimes they get disconnected from the teaching and it. Yeah. Whereas at school they tend to, you know, your teacher.

Yeah. In a classroom. Would probably know you a bit better. Yeah, than your average lecturer or Professor definitely. You might be one out of three. Exactly. Exactly can sometimes. Yeah. Can sometimes be You know. Don't put shoot that can put your native court situation. I mean, both both sides, right?

Because you know you can see that people struggling but yeah, always help those tools. That means too. Yeah. Okay, good. So we're done. Are we done with Vice Chancellor? Now? Yeah. We're done with vice Chancellor. There's so much we can say we should. Yeah. Well those those two I think those two are big things.

Yeah, definitely. That'll keep you busy as vice Chancellor.

So the next one is a sort of personal one. So, uh, ask all the guests on the show, uh, one tune, one podcast, one book, and one film you'd recommend. I've been spraying this, how, which one do I choose? I thought I should choose. I'm gonna go with the tune and I actually had an English song for, you know, um, a tune but I think personally, I relate my first languages Urdu and there's a lot of good Urdu music.

I listened to and I would love to, like, say the name. I don't know if you would, it's called Joom. And June, is that from a film? No, it's a, there's a so this, this platform is called Coke Studio. And in that like, uh, independent singers, they come and like, they sing together.

Sometimes they sing a song, and it's just like, they recorded in this video, and it's a very big thing. So, like, in India and Pakistan, everyone will really know about it. But obviously, I don't expect you to know why. So, how would you spell that j-o-o-m? Right? Yes. And, um, I definitely recommend you listen to it.

I think you might like it Duncan. Um, but uh, that's my favourite song.

I'll tell you one, but I'll choose this one just to be. Yeah. Right. We'll add that to the playlist. Let's add it to the code. Um I mean one is a podcast. I okay this It's completely fine. Like Don't even know how to tell you this, but the one podcast I listened to is called serial killers.

It's okay. I sound like a true crime thing. Yes, I am. So obsessed with so many people into True Crimes. Let's come up on this show before. Oh that's good. That's good. I'm glad though you're not trying to be a serial killer. No no no I'm definitely not but it is so interesting.

Just knowing how these people behave and like I just it's so gruesome in a way and I actually listened to it while I'm going to sleep as well. So like and that's just I know it's crazy helping myself. Receive. It's just like the only time I'm freeing, you know.

Yeah. But um yeah that's that's one I definitely recommend. You also try this once quite good. So that's podcast from about a book. Wow. Oh, in the last five years? Yeah, I have read so much, even before these five years, I, I I'm a big reader, uh, Is a few, I would I think Khalid Hussaini.

He's an Afghan writer and he's written. Of a thousand Splendisons and a kai trainer. And this is like about the struggle in like both of. These are stories about people in Afghanistan. One's a girl, one's a boy and it's just these are amazing books and anyone like I would honestly recommend reading them.

There's other books, obviously, I could. Oh my God, I read so much. I can give you a whole list, like, you know, but the booktube is such a good book. I don't know if you ever read this, okay? Yeah, like, I'll definitely recommend Cloud disease. Yeah. And then the last one is a film.

Okay, this has like, I'm just gonna say a silly film because I love this film, it's called the terminal Uh, I don't know if you have you watched. It is being stuck in an airport. Yeah, yeah. And um it's the guy from Costa Rio. What's his name? Tom Hanks.

Tom Hanks, yes and I love love, love that movie. It's such a good movie. It's my comfort movie. It's like you know, he's just stuck in the airport and then he goes from, it's so good. I would definitely recommend anyone. You know, when they show us something about him being stuck in, he's kind of in.

No man's land, isn't it? Because he's neither, he's not in the country and he's not a resident. His old country just exists. Yeah. Exactly. And you just can't leave the airport and he's just made like a full ecosystem. He's just living there, sleeping. They're eating there, it's actually crazy.

I love that movie. Right. Okay, good.

The physics department, a colleague of ours in the physics department has built a time machine. Okay? They tell me that it works. Um, you can step into that time machine and go meet yourself 2019 arriving here. Um, what advice would you offer? A young. Amen about getting most of her time in University so when I first started University, it's like in 2019 all the way back.

Okay, there's gonna be a silly one. And I actually said this in the other podcast as well, and it's really funny. So, you know, when I first came here and, um, you have to put your hand out to call the bus. Amount of times in the first year where I would just be stood there and the bus would just come and go.

And you know, I would like once I was finally managed to get on the bus, I would have to get off and I wouldn't know to press the stop button and then the bus was just keep going. So I was just either meant to not go again on the bus or like come off the bus.

And I think that's something everyone who has decided University or come to the country should know because somebody stops have multiple buses. Exactly. So they don't unless someone says, well, I didn't know that so I would just be stood there. Expectantly like, oh my God, it's gonna stop now.

I just wish by It's got, it has got a little bit better because the Oxford Road in particular was really bad because we had deregulated buses. Whether unlike London, there is one bus company. There were lots of competing. Yeah, yeah. So now you get these yellow buses, and it's all the same.

It's actually like so hard to actually, get up, but sometimes and then tonight boy to know even shop for you. That was me in 2019. I was like, oh my God, this country. What do I do? On a very practical. A practical thing to tell your former self. Is there any?

Are there any other things? Yeah. I think, like, I'm actually very happy with my journey in this department. And at University, I, if I'm getting a bit sad, not thinking about, like, all of this is ending and it's actually hitting me right now as I speak, but, um, I, I don't know.

I think I would, uh, say it like, Don't as a computer scientist, especially, it's very easy to just focus on. Uh, just coding and like your courseworks. I think like, personally, you should definitely go and You know, like expand your horizons, definitely like I would, um, in first year when I saw Foundation, I wasn't very, you know, social and uh like what didn't join societies for like until I was in second there.

And I would tell myself like go right now go and join like five societies a few months because that is the time at the beginning of the degree when you have all this time. Obviously in 30 and second day, it gets really hot. But first here is when you should go make as many friends as you want you know, like get to know people because like right now I have friends who are here from all over the world and they're just all gonna go back and like maybe in 10 years I'll remember like I'll go to a country, they live in and I could just hit them up.

Be like, oh, you know, I'm here. 10 years later. Do you want to meet up? So it's it's this is like the biggest opportunity. You get basically at University to meet so many people from diverse groups.

It's just good to come out of your comfort zone to come out of what you know and like just go and like explore what? You don't know maybe try something new. Yeah, exactly. Like I tried so many new things in this like five years I could not even imagine.

Yeah yeah that's good advice I think okay. Well, uh, I that's a company of our questions. So Thank you, Iman for coming on the show. You're so welcome. Uh, not gonna have a question for you as well. How how is like, you know? Just because, you know, you're you're so great.

You've been a great podcast host, how do you feel like, you know, with this podcast uh how is it going for you like the University? Yeah, I I I really enjoy recording these podcasts. It's quite good. It's good fun. Like finding out a little bit more about people's backstory.

Yeah. But then also, They're a good fun to record, but then they're also I find them really useful in teaching because I use them as examples where I say, You can talk very generically and say, oh, it's really important to go and join a society in your first year.

If I say, well, if you don't believe me, This is Emma. She, this is what she said. She said, it's really good point to join, you know, try Society. So, It's enjoyable to do as a thing as a, you know, as a personal thing but also as a professional thing, it's really useful to say.

To have examples. Yeah, this is, this is, uh, this is an example. It's like your m s experience as well. Interesting using retail and stuff like that. So, Um, thanks. Thank you for coming. We look forward to seeing you next week. Oh graduation and you'll be a prize giving for your prizes as well.

Yeah, so we'll see you there and um Enjoy your your new job. Thank you. We literally just started three days ago. We look forward to hearing more about that in the future. Thank you so much. Thank you for having me. Thank you for coming. Right, good news. Okay, so nice.

It was amazing. Thank you, thank you so much for having me. I had so much fun. Yeah, it's good. Fun doing them. I didn't do. I know people do. Um, I know, Jasmine does the thing where she films at the same time and I'm like,

It's it's a lot. One of the nice things about podcasting is I made videos but it just takes ages to make videos and edit videos. I mean they're good, I can imagine. But actually with audio it's so simple. You just all I'll do is I'll just add a little bit to the beginning.

Yeah. And a little bit at the end publish the audio and that's done. The transcript takes longer but it's so, you know. It's kind of simple. Yeah. Uh, but Jasmine had the whole team editing it. Yeah, yeah. Maybe, maybe, come with time, I do another podcast. I do a teaching podcast where we actually give it to a company and they edit it.

Of course that's easier but um, This one is just a, a Lo-Fi. So let me save that before definitely. We should take this healthy. Oh yes, yeah, of course wait, I will clean my camera.

There we go. Which way is the camera that way? Is it outside to look at the right part of the phone or it looks strange? Great. Got three. I'll send them to you. Yeah. Great. I'll be fantastic. Just say this, where's it going? Yeah.

Done amazing. Thanks, great. So I'm not letting you know when I publish it and is it okay if I post it? So what I've done in the past is I'll do a little post on LinkedIn. Yeah. And is it okay to tag you in that? Of course. Yeah. And then Um, yeah, that's the other thing is um, so On what I've done for.

Most people is take. Linkedin picture. All right. Yeah. To have as the the main picture for the page, there'll be a page. It'll be slash, is it okay to have to reuse your LinkedIn? Yeah, yeah. That's completely fine as well.

One. Because there's two, there's another one that's like later one, right? Yeah. Right. And your family or in Manchester anyway, so it's easy for them. So some people have family coming from, you know, Yeah, good. Um yeah, thank you so much. Well, I don't want to go close the door.

Uh, it's all right, that's fine. All there. Right great. Thank you Iman. See you